Livefyre Profile

Activity Stream

This woman is a student, if she is a traditional student and in undergrad, then she isn't that old, so she gets a teeny tiny crumb of a pass from me as she has more living to do.  One thing I noticed clicking the link briefly, and then running away is that she identifies as mixed.  I don't want to sidetrack or start a war, but I've had the experience on multiple occasions where mixed or very light women will insist that white men are the devil to be avoided at all costs and that only black men are decent. 

 

I think this might be because she probably is speaking from a position of privilege as she might legitimately be receiving better treatment from color-struck black men, which is still a form of fetishizing.  I've also noticed this attitude to be very common in lighter black women are overweight, slightly so or extremely so, they might be having a harder time attracting the attention or respectful approach of types of men so since only black men pay attention they have a deathgrip on them.  A similar discussion came up a long time ago on "A Black Girl's Guide to Weightloss", where commenters brought up the role of colorism in a post on "dating while fat".

 

Spaces like these are a huge threat to women like her because they fear that black men will think twice when approaching which doesn't leave her with many other options.  I think this article is ridiculous, but I don't think its completely fair to discount what her actual experiences might be versus overall trends in how black men treat black women.  

1 year, 3 months ago on This is one of the Reasons So Many White Guys Think Black Women are Off Limits.

Reply

 @Toni_M  I agree.  I just want to say classism isn't inherently a bad thing.  Its a form of protection.  When families and ethnic groups practice it, its because they are attempting to protect assets, properties, social standing and interests.

1 year, 3 months ago on Show Me the Links!! We're Self-Hating "White Meat" Chasers? Show Me Where.

Reply

The only crime this site could sometimes be accused of is classism.  But since DBR blacks instinctively associate seeking higher class with seeking white, self-improvement articles are automatically associated with "wanting to be white", or "white worship", in my humble opinion.

 

As for a lot of the articles specifically mentioning white men, why wouldn't they?  As someone engaged to a south Asian man, even I think it would be INSANE to tell black women seeking interracial relationships to overlook nearly 70% of the male population.  Especially when that 70% is more likely to have the qualities upwardly mobile women are looking for.   And inter-marriage with other types of man has been mentioned on this site, but look at all the biases some groups have towards African-Americans, that includes black immigrant groups. 

 

Mentioning white men only makes those on Clutch and other sites extremely uncomfortable because it breaks down that myth of POC solidarity they seem so attached to.  The idea that its OK as long as they aren't white.  If you look on most of those sites, there are TONS of non-black women mentioned where its business at usual, but very few non-black men NOT mentioned in a negative context.  Essence puts a man who doesn't even date black women on its cover, call me when a man of any other race who DOES date black women makes the cover, especially a white man. 

 

These women are so used to the men in their communities and families picking up any other community's leftovers, that they expect all of us to be happy doing the same.  They don't realize that its more compilcated to date and marry when you wish to be upwardly mobile and practice hypergamy and are black because the people you seek out are vetting you just as you are vetting them. 

1 year, 3 months ago on Show Me the Links!! We're Self-Hating "White Meat" Chasers? Show Me Where.

Reply

To answer some comments below, there is a racist undercurrent in many European nations that the people that live there won't cop to or fully admit.   Its different than it is here in the US because they have a different history.   And interracial relationships aren't going to fix or change that.  That shouldn't stop anyone from dating, travelling and living their lives.

 

Especially when you consider,  the high level of income disparity amongst ethnic minorities and whites.  All you have, particularly in the UK are black men from the lower class, taking up with white women from the lower class and raising a mixed child at a socioeconomic disadvantage.  We all know the correlation between poverty and crime and many other things.  You can't blame this all on DBR African-Americans as minorities in some European countries are worse off socioeconomically than they are here in the US if you look at the numbers. 

 

I do think what happened in London was an isolated incident, but as someone who has travelled to and worked in many cities, I'm always on guard, whether I'm alone or not and I would advise anyone to do the same, I don't think anyone should be discouraged or afraid. 

1 year, 3 months ago on On Your Guard: The ‘Blacklash’ Has Begun. Violence Against BW/WM Couples and Families Trending.

Reply

 @StarleishaG also, if you have a smart phone, the google maps app is a god send.

1 year, 4 months ago on On Your Guard: The ‘Blacklash’ Has Begun. Violence Against BW/WM Couples and Families Trending.

Reply

 @StarleishaG I agree with be vigilant, and honestly if you see a bunch of shady looking dudes just hanging around CROSS THE STREET.  I can't tell people this enough and don't make eye contact, and no smiling at strangers if they are creeping you out, it only makes it worse. 

 

 Avoid entering secluded subway entrances after dark, especially in parts of midtown which get empty out of dark.  Also try to avoid taking the train super late, if you have been partying/drinking, just spend the money on a cab, you'll be much happier you did.  Try to stay in Manhattan if you can, don't be too tempted by cheap hotel deals outside of the city center.

1 year, 4 months ago on On Your Guard: The ‘Blacklash’ Has Begun. Violence Against BW/WM Couples and Families Trending.

Reply

I really think its worth acknowledging that this took place in the UK.  Particularly in East London, which is pretty rough in some parts.  I could be wrong, but I feel like some of the "bad" neighborhoods in London were kind of worse than the "bad" neighborhoods in NYC.  I'm only speaking from MY experience, I don't travel much in the U.S., most of my my travel has been out of the country, I've never had major problems in NYC (Manhattan), where I live/work, save the occasional slick comment from from a worker, or dudes hanging outside homeless shelters.  

 

I think the underlying racial tension and socioeconomic issues/class differences make this worse in Europe.  The only times we've felt nervous, unsafe or have been blatantly gawked or menaced by black men has been in London, Stockholm, Copenhagen, Amsterdam, Paris, and from black men in South and Central America and the Caribbean.    These were usually workers, delivery men, dudes just sort of hanging around, etc.  I think you really need to be careful when travelling especially if you don't speak the language or don't know the city too well. 

1 year, 4 months ago on On Your Guard: The ‘Blacklash’ Has Begun. Violence Against BW/WM Couples and Families Trending.

Reply

Blackwomendeservebetter:

"GUEST AUTHOR: THANK YOU SOOOO MUCH FOR WRITING THIS!I am disappointed (although not surprised) at Black America's defense of Jeantel. Why must we fervently defend every symbol of ineptitude, mediocrity and anti-social behavior?"

 

THANK YOU!  Some of the things said by blacks to defend her as well as every white person who took a couple of courses in African-American studies in college is making me cringe.  They don't realize it, but they are literally insulting poor black people and people who speak English as a second language by defending her.  I'm so sick of the discussions of African-American Vernacular English, code-switching, speaking English as a second language, etc.

 

I know it stings hearing racists and self-hating blacks attack this woman, more so for her appearance than for her diction but some of the arguments people have been coming up with to counter this are cringe-inducing.  Poor and working class black people don't live in caves with Tyler Perry Movies and gangster rap music videos on endless loop, they are well aware of what "white", or "proper" speech sounds like.  They have tv's some even with (gasp) cable, they watch the news, movies, television shows.  And people who speak English as a second language don't end up graduating high-school at 20, that really isn't typical. 

 

I don't need to call her beautiful, I don't need to say I don't think she's that fat, her appearance has no bearing on her testimony.  Like I said before she couldn’t have slipped in her skinny light-skinned body before heading to court that day.  I don't think she did such a great job, but I don't think she represents a failing school system, a failure of whites and middle-class blacks to understand black speech, or what is wrong with American black women, she just represents herself.  She isn't a political symbol.  When Conrad Murray's wacky, skinny, lighter complected stripper baby mama made a fool of herself in court, I didn't see everyone rushing to her defense, maybe its because her boyfriend killed the king of pop, but still....

1 year, 4 months ago on Letter From a Reader: "Where Were Rachel Jeantel's People?!"

Reply

the more I've learned about disordered eating as it pertains to black women, the more I see that black dysfunction is fertile ground for all types of eating disorders/body dismorphia.  I think there still isn't enough information out there because black women are assumed to be perfectly happy with our bodies all times.  I feel like this could be a huge barrier to a woman seeking treatment/counseling for disordered eating.

1 year, 4 months ago on Is "Thinspiration" Dangerous for our Girls?

Reply

Pardon the armchair diagnoses, but I really, honestly, truly do believe this girl might be a bit slow.  And that we are being way too hard on her, even the well-meaning people.  I understand that there is a VERY loaded history attached to this which makes us uncomfortable if you so much as insinuate that this overweight, dark-skinned, black woman might be of lower intelligence, but it is what it is. 

 

If it wasn't her speech patterns/accent, it would have been her body.  From what I've read, quite a few people are cracking fat jokes, it's not like she could have slipped into her skinny body before heading into the courtroom.  And if it wasn't her weight, it would have been her skin tone.  You really cant win here. 

 

On a side note, whenever I see situations like these, it reminds me of the contentious relationship I had with my mother growing up who was often very strict with me in terms of the way I presented myself, from my speech patterns (no AAVE or friends that had AAVE speech patterns), the music I listened to, my hair and nails (I wasn't allowed weaves, extensions or certain hairstyles or bright fake nails) and my weight/fitness (we ate fairly healthy and she made sure I was active).  She was trying to spare me this kind of scrutiny, and I didn't truly realize it until I entered the workforce. But you can only spare a young black girl so much....

 

 

1 year, 4 months ago on Letter From a Reader: "Where Were Rachel Jeantel's People?!"

Reply

 @Toni_M I know a lot of this relates to privilege, but I think its problematic to put a picture up of a real body in an article like this, because in a sense you are saying the body isn't "real", sort of like putting a picture up of a naturally light-skinned woman near an article about skin bleaching....

 

A few years ago an actual friend of mine who is a model had her picture posted on Jezebel in a post about fashion week.  Some of the comments were so nasty, she's a very skinny East African girl, naturally from two skinny parents, I really felt upset for her, and she was annoyed when she found out. 

 

I think in this thinspo discussion we forget we are looking at pictures of real people, and there is a big difference between saying this is unobtainable for YOU, and this is unobtainable PERIOD.  Its problematic to use a picture to illustrate healthy or unhealthy, especially when we constantly let aesthetics creep into the conversation without realizing it (aka this LOOKS healthy and this doesn't).

1 year, 4 months ago on Is "Thinspiration" Dangerous for our Girls?

Reply

 @Brenda55  @kia 

 

"What the 'The Moxie Sophic' article does and, with all due respect, you often do is make the mistake of seeing every problem of black women, black male centered.  True the interactions with black males in this area count among the most painful for black women.  That said doing this you miss a lot of nuance and you miss the full scope of the problem and in the end risk making problems worse since the diagnosis is faulty and leads to an ineffective intervention making the situation worse."

 

THIS.

 

As someone who exists in the "middle", I'm sad to say that my experiences with colorism have always been with women lighter than me, it was never really from black men.  But my experience doesn't mean that fair-skinned black women are solely to blame for colorism, its black men, its black women, its everyone, its culture, its media, its complicated. 

1 year, 4 months ago on Dark Girls Documentary Hits Home For Some

Reply

 @Bellatrix79 the trend towards more model-type women, i.e. actual major agency models started in the late 90's when rap wanted to be super high end.  Remember the Jay-z/Pharrell video "change clothes"?  Russell Simmons was a known modelizer even before then. Its just that yet again delusional black women ignored this and insisted they were the exception to this sort of beauty standard.  its false.  The girl that looks like Naomi 2.0 is making more money and getting higher level work/better treatment than Twerkina McTwerky the stripper with "ass shots".   Even if the former is dark-skinned and the latter light, its another dichotomy that often gets overlooked.

1 year, 4 months ago on Who Besides Me is Glad More White Chicks are Becoming Video H*es?

Reply

 @Avoc42883 On a side note, pardon my rant....this is why I've actually actively discouraged black girls Ive worked with who want to be singers/dancers/entertainers/"models" (I put models in quotes because unless you are modeling with a major agency, you are going to have a hard time).  Its harsh, but it needs to be done.  You really aren't going to break any major barriers being a singer or an actress, there is a surplus of those.  There are other opportunities within the entertainment/fashion industry where you can be more influential and make more money.   I’ve actually observed girls missing days of work or school for the "privilege" of being on set for 12 hours, for a rate that works out to be below minimum wage all while being treated like crap.

 

We had a black woman win an Oscar for playing a maid and now 75 years later, we have..... a black woman winning an Oscar for playing a maid.  That's supposed to be progress?  We've just refined the Mammy.   

 

There is a SERIOUS shortage of available black people to fill high level jobs in fashion/entertainment we have too many actors/models/dancers and not enough writers/editors/producers.  /rant over.

1 year, 4 months ago on Who Besides Me is Glad More White Chicks are Becoming Video H*es?

Reply

 @Aabaakawad  @zipporah  @Avoc42883 yep, because most of these jobs call for women only.

1 year, 4 months ago on Who Besides Me is Glad More White Chicks are Becoming Video H*es?

Reply

I'm glad, but I'm also going to be a bit of a negative Nancy,  I think that unless we see videos that are 100% white women, not just the occasional token light-skinned girl or "ethnic" (Armenian, Persian, Italian) girl you will still have wilfully delusional black girls trying to be in videos, claiming there isn't a problem.  Plus black girls add a level of "ratchet authenticity" you can't get from a white girl, (e.g. see Miley Cyrus' new video)

 

I haven't worked on a video in a few years now, and I pretty much avoid urban work like the plague, but in my observation, white girls were usually booked from agencies which set their rate in addition to agency fees.   When there were more black girls around, light or dark they were usually booked through 3rd tier agencies, casting directors that mostly do hip-hop videos, low level casting sites, personal contacts and even Craigslist.  The lower the level of casting/the smaller the budget, the more black girls.  And they were usually paid less money, sometimes astonishingly low rates, like 50 bucks for 14 hours on set, for example.  There was usually the occasional "Coco-T" type white girl, who also were on the lower end of things.

 

I hate to say it but as a result of how people were booked, usually the white models were more professional and easier to work with. 

 

A big part of the "video ho" situation is that black girls trying to be in videos/entertainment far exceeds the 12% that we make up of the population, and on top of that slots are limited.  So they get taken for granted and ran through like a box of tissues.  Until that stops, I don't see the video-ho situation changing. Because in general, the more low-budget, ratchet, BET Uncut-ish the video is, the more black girls it has in it and there are always plenty lining up to be in the video.

1 year, 4 months ago on Who Besides Me is Glad More White Chicks are Becoming Video H*es?

Reply

whooo, at this point my belly is so full of popcorn I'm about to explode, at last it's the kind with no butter or added salt.....

 

Anyways, I think it comes down to this.  People keep countering this post with this myth of "choice".  I choose not to get married.  I choose to raise my children alone.  I choose to be in tons of student loan debt.  I choose to live paycheck to paycheck.  I choose to not have a suitable mate with which I can raise my kids. 

 

If a "choice" is made out of necessity and self-preservation, is it really a choice?  If its the only viable option, is it really a choice? 

 

Were responsible, attractive men knocking down your door trying to marry you and raise kids with you?  Is there a long list of jobs out there which require no education or experience just begging to hire you?

 

On another note, there is no "quick fix" for black dysfunction.  A few years ago it was buying a home, before that it was nursing school, now it's get a degree, any degree.   We keep doing these things in droves, but the problems just keep piling up.....

1 year, 4 months ago on Black Women Are Spending Too Much Time and Effort Going to School, They Should Be Spending That Time Trying to Get Married

Reply

First of all, LOL at "Sister Christlo Dollar’s Play in the Snow and Blessings Will Flow Gospel"

 

anyways, le sigh.  this again.  I didn't see the original facebook post, but based on past posts I've seen here about weight I doubt it was that that shocking or offensive, just truthful, I'm assuming?

 

Anyways, this might be an unpopular opinion, but for me personally, I don't care that White Women are fat too, I don't care that most of the country is fat too, I also don't care that Black men are fat too either.  Because I'm not seeking to be just like anyone else, I'm seeking to be better, that's how you get ahead. Black women are the exception to the rule, in that we get judged more harshly, not the other way around. 

 

Unfortunately for women, physical attractiveness is expected along side intelligence.  A college degree, or degrees is just part of the package,  It's not fair, but it is what it is.  We've had overweight or obese posters insist that their life is perfectly fine, including one poster claiming to weigh around 400lbs, I don't believe you.  I've spent enough time in elite/exclusive spaces and have plenty of friends that work and play in them too, one thing I've never seen, and I say that with no exaggeration, is a significantly overweight or obese woman (or man actually), even the senior level women in their 40's, 50's and 60's in professional circles I've been in, are usually somewhat toned and in decent shape though obviously they don't have the bodies of 22 year olds, nor should they be expected to. 

 

If you see the sort of comments and reactions that being a thin/fit black woman elicits, you'll know we are a force to be reckoned with.  I know we come in all shapes and sizes, but NOTHING on this earth beats the body type of a thin or fit black woman, nothing, seriously we really do have amazing shapes, I've seen the most amazing bodies ever on black models and actresses I've worked with. 

 

Fat acceptance, as far as I'm concerned was never created for women of color, its basically for white women by white women, and honestly they can have it.  At the end of the day its about increasing your odds, I'm not interested in hedging my bets on being the exception to the rule....

 

 

 

 

1 year, 5 months ago on Lead, Follow, or Get Out of the Way: BB&W Is NOT Just a Swirling Club.

Reply

@Butterfly1010   I honestly couldn't be less interested in that movie, and this goes back to my original point.  There are are a WEALTH of marriageable men in Hollywood, not just the obvious actors, athletes, musicians, etc, but Agents, Lawyers, Bookers, Money Managers, Real Estate Brokers, Insurance Brokers, Producers, Directors, Doctors, Surgeons, Dentists, Car Dealers, Club Owners, Restaurant Owners, Boutique Owners, Contractors, Architects and all types of consultants. 

 

As for women like Eve, if they aren't apologizing they are out there trying to claim how tough their man or how good he is in bed. 

 

I remember this pretty black actress on VH1 (Denis Vasi) was being clowned for dating a white club owner because he was older and balding, she married a white video director and now the peanut gallery points out he's not tall.  Should she be chasing after ball players and rappers until she's 50, disappears and the next we hear of her is when she dies, gets her people magazine cover and leaves her money to the white man she quietly married when she thought the coast was clear?

1 year, 5 months ago on Why Would You Date or Marry a Known Racist?

Reply

 @Butterfly1010 I'm happy for your friends but the problem isn't preferences/skin color, its the assumption that a certain factor makes a man "safe" while others don't.   Hell there are a lot of "professional/educated" men whose salaries go right up their noses every weekend here in NYC (trust me). 

 

I mean look at the thread about dating Asian men.   Or the resistance some women have to dating older men (which I'm convinced for some comes from a fear of what others will say).  I really think that sometimes women let blackistan creep into their dating preferences/choices and don't even realize it.

1 year, 5 months ago on Why Would You Date or Marry a Known Racist?

Reply

Jamila:

"High quality black women (and, perhaps Latina's too) are available at 'fire sale' prices to non-black men (in this case, even to white racists) because there is such a dearth of quality black men (and quality men of color in general). I've seen white guys that had their GED/High school diploma date black woman after black women with a college degree--and these white guys could get these black women because there were far more single-and-looking black women than available mates."

 

Me:

I understand what you are saying and I don't completely disagree, but here's the thing.. I think a big barrier for black women is that many are not completely comfortable dating white men so they seek out men of other colors and "ethnic" white men and even white men with issues because they "don't really count" since they don't represent "the man".  If I had a dime for everytime I've heard "Italian/Greek men are ok, Jewish Men are ok, I like Filipino men because they are kind of ghetto (I've heard this one A LOT): or they seek out men from insular communities which may not necessarily be accepting of black people e.g. South Asian/East Asian/Central Asian/Middle Eastern men because they are men of color.  They assume they these types of men are "safe" and let their guard down.  I've seen it happen too many times.

 

A lot of these women are seeking out men with "swagger" or who are tough and aggressive.  These are going to be men from lower socioeconomic backgrounds, whose communities have issues which mirror that of the black community.  And while some of the women in those communities are getting out and dating and marrying up,  and the higher status men are marrying within the community or seeking white trophies black women are seeking out what's left. 

 

Most Asian women are not out there marrying 6foot2 millionaire Brad Pitt's, they are marrying doctors, insurance brokers, men who work in finance or real estate or in the tech industry, most of these men are everyday men some more attractive than others, but can provide for their families.

 

My fiance works in a field full of nerds and its basically a running joke that all the white nerds are married to Asian women.  And these are Asian American women who are educated and have options.  Most of these women don't care what anyone thinks, especially not Asian men.  Trust me, some these men would LOVE to date/marry a cute black girl, but most can't get the time of day from one.  I really feel that too many black women are seeking out men of other colors in the interest of POC solidarity, men with some sort of edge or waiting for their Michael Fassbender twin because they think that if they have a man like that, no one can say anything negative about their relationship.

1 year, 5 months ago on Why Would You Date or Marry a Known Racist?

Reply

The fact that the President has been saying different versions of this speech over the past 5 years despite the backlash, means he actually gives a damn.  He grew up without his father for god sakes.

 

This is what it comes down to, If the broken/dysfunctional family structure within Black communities isn't fixed, no amount of funding will ever help.

1 year, 5 months ago on President Obama Addresses the Importance of Personal Responsibility During Morehouse Commencement Speech

Reply

 @DWB  @Avoc42883 yes that's exactly what I'm saying.  My knowledge of this (notice I didn't say belief) is that for some people they realize their sexual orientation at pre-teen age or a bit younger, even though (hopefully) they aren't sexually active. 

 

Now I say hopefully because I don't think its a great idea for pre-teens especially or even teens to be sexually active because of the emotional ramifications in addition to the physical/biological risks we are all well aware of.

 

But that's part of the danger of reducing homosexuality down to an "act" if its an "act", nothing more nothing less, then what difference does it make how or when I have it?  If I have it at 14 with a 40 year old man and don't use protection for example?

 

as for the attraction, based on my knowledge sexuality isn't a binary state, LGBTQ - Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Questioning.  I don't honestly think that if you are questioning that engaging in a sex act will make the decision for you or that doing that is necessarily healthy sexual behavior.  Or that if you are gay, having heterosexual sex will make you straight.

 

...sorry for the tangent...

1 year, 5 months ago on Gabourey Sidibe on Jason Collins:"Every Woman Has Dated a Gay Man At Least Once"

Reply

 @DWB what does that have to do with sex in the gendered sense?  You asked me if I believe in more than one sex? I was talking about intercourse.  Not whether there is another classification beyond male and female.

 

As for homosexuality beyond the sex act whether you have sex or not you are still gay, just like when I was a virgin and a teenager I was still heterosexual. 

 

If the closeted pastor has sex with a man on Saturday night and then comes into church on Sunday and gives a sermon denouncing homosexuality, he's still gay.  He wasn't just gay for one night. 

1 year, 5 months ago on Gabourey Sidibe on Jason Collins:"Every Woman Has Dated a Gay Man At Least Once"

Reply

 @DWB I'm not sure what you mean exactly?  Not being smart but can you clarify?  Because this question sounds more of a scientific nature. But I'm not sure what sex has to do with homosexuality exactly.

1 year, 5 months ago on Gabourey Sidibe on Jason Collins:"Every Woman Has Dated a Gay Man At Least Once"

Reply

EnJay: " I think a lot of people reduce homosexuality as an "act," and just focus on the sex act."

 

Yep, and to that effect it actually makes homophobia more perverse when you think about it. 

 

As for Gabourey's comment a lot of people are sidestepping her comment and denying it because they are polite.  For clarification go to a more "ratchet" site and see the comments on her there.... lol.

1 year, 5 months ago on Gabourey Sidibe on Jason Collins:"Every Woman Has Dated a Gay Man At Least Once"

Reply

LOL no surprises here.  I don't take urban clients anymore, I need my sanity.  But there are PLENTY of people who work in hip-hop/urban related fields that would have NOTHING to do with the demographic they are marketing to or the rappers they work with. 

 

I once had someone (a black woman, who only dated white men btw) offer me a job with a rapper, I declined and her pitch was this.. "look Avoc I can tell you don't listen to this shit and neither do I, but a job's a job, its a lot easier in many ways, think about it" . 

 

On multiple occasions I've heard people refer to their customers/demographic as "those people" or "these people".  We all know what "those people" means....

1 year, 5 months ago on BET Heiress Marries a Rainbeau! Just Goes to Show Rich Folks Want Ratchet For Eveyone Else EXCEPT Their Own.

Reply

 @Elegance  @Avoc42883 "I think MRAs are just as bad as feminists."  Here's the thing though, MRA is an inherently extremely position  there is no moderate MRA because the entire thing is based on a manipulation of the definition of feminism, feminism in its actual definition isn’t and doesn't have to be, but sadly its often misused, trivialized and taken too far.

 

I agree that men have their own social pressures to deal with, particularly white men, and to an extent Asian men.  But this goes back to the pedestal argument.  If you want to be on that pedestal or part of the group that occupies the space on the pedestal and accept the fringe benefits, you have to accept being held to a certain (often impossible) standard.  White men and Asian men are assumed by default to be providers and those that aren't are seen as "defective" and we wonder why they are more likely to "snap"?

 

Black men, however, are often applauded for doing the bare minimum because doing less is the expected norm.  Existing in a realm of low expectations while still retaining male privilege is a pretty sweet deal when you think about it.

1 year, 6 months ago on New Study Reveals 72% of Women Don't Call Themselves Feminists

Reply

This is not surprising to me, but I'm quite sure the average (read: mostly white) woman's beef with feminism is somewhat different from many black women's beef with feminism.   My issue with contemporary modes of feminism is that in can often exist in an academic vacuum whilst in practice, its manipulated to benefit the vocal majority declaring many groups invisible.  I've even noticed that the black women who side with contemporary feminism often dominate the conversation, coming from a place of privilege.  e.g. a clutch article written by a woman who got knocked up in GRAD SCHOOL as a response to the Bloomberg campaign aimed at TEEN PREGNANCY for a population that likely won't finish HIGH SCHOOL. 

 

On a side note, what I find really disturbing about these kinds of discussion is the women in them who sympathize with MRA's.  That literally terrifies me.  You know who makes up a decent part of MRA's?  DBR black men.  They love it.  Several of them frequently troll Clutch.  The MRA ideology is often used to explain the decline of the black community.  That black women are feminism on steroids and its black women's fault so many of them are single mothers because they "scare" all the black men away. Black women are scaring men huh?  Black women are super feminists huh?  Yep, I'm sure that explains the fact that we are several times more likely to be raped, assaulted, and murdered than white women.  It must be because black women are so "scary". 

1 year, 6 months ago on New Study Reveals 72% of Women Don't Call Themselves Feminists

Reply

Since  a few people have commented about how their asian partner's family has reacted, can anyone who has been in a similar situation share how your own family reacted knowing that your partner's family didn't accept you?  Did you get any "I told you so's?"

1 year, 6 months ago on Asian Mothers are CRAY!! Second Story I've Heard of Moms Threatening Suicide Over Black Girlfriends!

Reply

As someone engaged to a an East Indian man with a friend who is also engaged to an East Asian man.  We have both heard our fair share of "girl, watch out, they hate black people!" warnings.

 

I understand cultural sensitivity is necessary, but if something doesn't work for you, it just doesn't work for you, period the end, get out.  I met my soon to be in-laws early on in the relationship.  I flat out asked him before then whether or not his parents would have a problem with my race.  He assured me it would be no problem, and it hasn't been.  His parents are not "Americanized" but he is.  His mother is controlling or at least tries to be, but he has her at arms length when need be and has no problem telling her when to stay out of his/our business.   She's been nothing but loving and accepting towards me.

 

I think Christelyn is being very understanding here but failing to acknowledge a certain aspect of the dynamic between foreign born parents and their American born children.  As someone with a foreign family I speak from experience.   My mother can give you the silent treatment like there is no tomorrow.

 

The reason these boyfriends are running into these issues is because for years they played the passive aggressive, "yes man" game with their parents, never asserting themselves, ever.  They simply did things behind their parents back in situations where their parents might not approve, or manipulated situations to make it seem like they were being good, obedient sons. 

 

The thing is you can't really hide a marriage to a black woman from your parents.  So now they have to come clean.  Assume the guy is in his early 30's,  so his mother has now had 30 something years of him doing whatever she wants (or so she thinks) and then all of a sudden he comes out of left field with something major like this.  Of course she'll go nuts.  This is the consequence of playing the "good son" for all those years. 

1 year, 6 months ago on Asian Mothers are CRAY!! Second Story I've Heard of Moms Threatening Suicide Over Black Girlfriends!

Reply

This isn't about hair, its a lot deeper and a lot sicker than that.  Its about the constant need to "knock" Beyonce down a peg by pointing out that no matter what she's a "negro"  and so are her kids.  Remember the obsession with whether or not her daughter would turn out looking like Jay-Z?  Or the slick jokes about how her baby won't be born with a blonde weave?  Its no different than the trolls that e-mail Christelyn to make comments about her appearance.  What does it say about a person when their go to insult is "you're black, don't forget it"?

1 year, 6 months ago on Black Women Have a Sickness When It Comes to Hair

Reply

While society has changed if you are a man in your 50's there is also the issue of opportunity.  For example say the man's first wife was his highschool sweetheart.  Well we still live in a segregated society, more so back then, due to several factors, his high-school sweetheart would also be white.  It doesn't mean he was consciously choosing a white woman, its just what was available to him and he picked a suitable mate from that pool, same thing goes if he had met his wife at college or at work. 

 

Now say that man is now divorced, and he prefers younger women.  If it wasn't a young black woman, it would have been a young white woman, a young asian woman, etc.  So why is it an issue if its a young black woman?

1 year, 6 months ago on True or False? "White Guys Only Date Black Women After They've Had White Kids with White Women!"

Reply

 @Elegance  @Toni_M  @Christelyn   @IAOSingleMoms I'd also like to add that when it comes to who is "built that way", there is a massive diet industry in East Asia, liposuction and diet training programs are big business in Korea, and if you go into an Asian market in Chinatown/Flushing here in NYC etc there are TONS upon TONS of diet teas, and "slimming creams".

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

 @Toni_M  @Christelyn   @Elegance  @IAOSingleMoms yep, this is why when we talk about the pedestal, especially when it comes to putting brown-skinned women on the pedestal (though colorism is a whole other ball of wax)  we are going to have to accept that the woman on the pedestal might not have the same body as us as she is being held to hollywood/media standards.  Kerry Washington anyone?

 

We are forgetting the simple fact that there is someone with our skin color on that pedestal benefits us all. 

 

I think the expectation that black women are to be completely "untouched" by those standards is completely ridiculous.  And Queen Latifah and Hattie McDaniel types aren't being placed on the pedestal either, they are simply allowed to occupy the empty space around it every once in a while.

 

Some white women often fight to be off the pedestal because they don't want the obligations while they are simultaneously reaping the benefits of being there.   Some black women want these same benefits and want to occupy that space without the obligations.  It doesn't work that way. 

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

 @Christelyn   @Elegance  @IAOSingleMoms I've heard women say that as well.  But they are lying to themselves and making excuses.  If you are truly curvy no amount of weight loss or fitness will change that.  I can personally confirm there are women in hollywood/media, black and otherwise that are considered "curvy" or voluptuous but can easily fit a sample size dress to wear to an event or on set.  This entire conversation is so muddled because we keep equating curvy with fat and thin/fit with anorexic/scary skinny.

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

 @The Working Home Keeper  @Kiera  @IAOSingleMoms its funny everyone always mentions baby got back, lol.  seriously, watch the video on youtube and then find a fat woman in it, I dare you.

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

 @clmason  @Avoc42883 nothing in this post implies that black women should feed into a vapid and misogynistic mindset so I'm not sure what you are getting at.

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

 @foreverhopeful Yes I hope she gets help as well but even speaking to someone as a woman of color can be very difficult because you can't always find empathy. 

 

I get this vibe some of the posters here dismiss eating disorders and the commenters mentality as "some crazy white girl stuff" without realizing the external factors that come into play.   The thing about disordered eating is its really hard to correct your behavior when those around you are praising you for it. and encouraging it.   

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

To anyone commenting to the young lady below, I don't think some of you have a true understanding of the type of environment she is likely dealing with.   Many young (white) men at that age simply won't acknowledge women who aren't a size 0/2.  They flat out ignore you and look past you or they act as if you are only good for sex..  Even the ones that like a different body type won't admit it because of peer pressure and fear of ridicule. 

 

As someone else stated on this post, "fat-hate" among younger white men is VERY real.  I went to a predominately white high-school and college.  My white female friends would often just split a candy bar for lunch, I saw others eat plain lettuce with tuna and that would be all they ate all day.  They were praised for being "hot", at that age I was an absolute beanpole so I also had the "pleasure" of being considered hot too. 

 

Well when you are super skinny you hear all the cruel things boys say about heavier girls and it feeds into your desire to keep your weight down. 

 

When my younger brother was in college, a frat got in trouble because they sent out a party invite stating that they were going to weigh girls at the door and any girl that gets into the party and wears over a size 2 "deserved to be raped".  He told me a lot of guys who saw the invite found it hilarious. 

 

When I was in school I had a roommate one year, a hispanic girl on scholarship who lived in a mostly black/hispanic neighborhood.  She was used to getting a lot of attention  because of her fair skin, long hair and green eyes.   She was about 5 feet tall and a size 6 with a curvaceous lower half.  At school most of the boys pretty much ignored her, it was a huge culture shock for her and caused her deep depression.  I saw this happen to a lot of black and hispanic women when I was in college given the high number of affluent whites at my school. 

 

To the young lady below, please strive to have the fittest HEALTHIEST body you can and trust me after college it will get better, especially if you travel and get out there in the country/world.  I know that starvation seems like a solution but it will hurt your metabolism in the long run and affect your health and grades.  I know it isn't fair but please, please try and focus on your studies and building a network of friends, it WILL payoff, trust me. 

1 year, 6 months ago on A White Guy's Honest Opinion About Black Women...and Their Weight.

Reply

I wanted to add something else, for any of the younger women who are considering entering "glamourous"  "sexy" fields like media, entertainment, pr, fashion be aware of the fact that you will spend LONG hours working surrounded by straight women and gay men.  This can make dating VERY hard.  And the superficial mentality in these fields breeds chauvinistic attitudes in the few straight men available.  I know a lot of single women in my field who are having a hard time now and are well into their thirties.  If you want to enter these fields meeting someone through your college/grad network of friends is really crucial.  I'm only really, truly realizing this as I get older and I'm very lucky I was able to meet someone amazing in college. 

 

Most of my friends that have met their significant other through work were working in more male dominated fields, medical, law, tech industry. 

1 year, 7 months ago on The Feminist Backlash Continues: Princeton Alumn Advises Women to Seek Out Their Future Husbands in College | Beyond Black & White

Reply

 @Aabaakawad  @Avoc42883 lol.  it can't possibly make it worth it.  I'm no apologist, but if we are laughing at fake "mrs. orman", then we also need to laugh at the "real" mrs. orman". 

 

I can't imagine one of my female friends calling me up like "ooo girl, I just met a great guy!  He's 70, he has 4 maybe 5 maybe 6 kids from previous relationships and he just left his partner of 40 years high and dry.    I'm so excited!"

1 year, 7 months ago on 'Playing house is not a good look,' the ex-girlfriend of 'Sesame Street' actor Roscoe Orman learns that lesson the hard way

Reply

hmmm, so lemme get this straight, if anyone, even a black woman, writes an article telling black women to take better care of themselves, re-think single motherhood and consider their weight, they are shot down, called racist, called self-hating.

 

But this ass writes this trash and he's getting applause all around?  Good thing I never took off that tinfoil hat...

1 year, 7 months ago on Yet Another Liberal Horse-Poo Article Confirming the Necessity for BWE...

Reply

Whenever I hear these stories, my first thought, honestly, rather than to chastize the woman is to think:  who the hayyy-elll is dating/marrying these men after they've been in a long-term relationship or have a herd of children?  Seriously, who? what are they hoping to get out of this relationship?

1 year, 7 months ago on 'Playing house is not a good look,' the ex-girlfriend of 'Sesame Street' actor Roscoe Orman learns that lesson the hard way

Reply

thank you all!  To Brenda, we met in COLLEGE (!!) but did not date until a couple of years after.  I've kept the same core circle of friends since school. Tiny wedding in August for a long variety of reasons, cultural and monetary.  Seriously to all the younger people lurking, reading, almost EVERY coupled up/married couple I know now met in college, grad school or at work.  THINK ABOUT IT!!

1 year, 7 months ago on The Feminist Backlash Continues: Princeton Alumn Advises Women to Seek Out Their Future Husbands in College | Beyond Black & White

Reply

I see nothing wrong with what this woman said.  I read her original article over the weekend and did some thinking....  I've said this a million times and I'll say it again, too many women are not honest with themselves.

 

I know way too many women (mostly white) who are constantly shouting from the hilltops they don't want to get married or have kids but are still complaining they can't find anyone or complaining about the high numbers of white men dating Asian women.  That is one hell of a mixed message to be sending.  If you are a professional, marriage-minded white man in his 30's (their peers) why would you have anything to do with these women?  I've had white women act like I must be from planet mars because I've expressed a desire to get married (happening soon!)  and have children (we'll be on that shortly!).

 

 

1 year, 7 months ago on The Feminist Backlash Continues: Princeton Alumn Advises Women to Seek Out Their Future Husbands in College | Beyond Black & White

Reply

 @The Working Home Keeper you make a VERY good point.  She should be able to say her features make her beautiful without offending women that don't look like her.  But unfortunately she was asked a specific question and the manner in which she chose to answer it is the problem here.

 

Regardless ALL women need to be told they're beautiful, especially by their mothers and fathers, I truly believe that.  Beauty/conventional attractiveness doesn't come with an instant dose of self-esteem.  I've worked with too many beautiful black girls like her getting themselves into mess because they really, truly don't realize how beautiful they are.   

1 year, 7 months ago on To Whom It May Concern: Black Skin <em>Is</em> "International".

Reply

I wanted to add that statements like these trouble me because in case, we forget colorism is built on a system of white supremacy.  Placing whites at the top of the totem pole and dark-skinned black people at the bottom.  Everyone else is in the middle.  So what she's essentially saying  is that she is more than happy to occupy the space in the middle and based on the colorism she's counting on, that's the best she'll do.

 

Think about that.  Especially when someone like Naomi Campbell is definitely at the top of the totem pole.  Its one thing to say there is no totem pole but when you make statements about your skin tone in that manner you are absolutely banking on the totem pole.  Black women  can do better than the middle of the "totem pole".  MUCH better.

 

 

1 year, 7 months ago on To Whom It May Concern: Black Skin <em>Is</em> "International".

Reply

 @Toni_M  @Dandelion100 fashion houses can tell, they just don't care.   There is no shortage of white girls for them to choose from.  And as they work harder to appeal to clientele from East Asia and the Middle East black models are going to have it harder.  Its already happening.

1 year, 7 months ago on To Whom It May Concern: Black Skin <em>Is</em> "International".

Reply

Translation: "I'm not worried about racism because I have colorism on my side".

 

As someone who works in the industry, LOL at her.   And the IRONY that she's saying that Naomi Campbell. This is on par with the Ethiopian Miss Israel who stated that she isn't stuck with some "big nose" and that Ethiopian women have "better" features.

 

This conversation has NOTHING to do with how mixed people choose to identify.  This conversation is not about us, our relationships and our future or current children.  In a superficial industry, you simply don't get to define yourself.   You are hired purely on your look and what the powers that be THINK that look says.  That's it.  White women, the overwhelming majority  in this industry don't even have that luxury what makes anyone think that courtesy will be extended to a woman of color?

 

If she doesn't want to "embrace" her blackness, fine, it will be placed on her no matter what.  That's the truth.  I really want folks to think about the absurdity of claiming you don't want to be defined in a job that is PURELY based on how you look and NOTHING else. 

 

1 year, 7 months ago on To Whom It May Concern: Black Skin <em>Is</em> "International".

Reply