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i think thats an interesting point, had grayson finally had enough. Had I been in his shoes, I would have felt my hackles rise as the andy o'brien statement got read out. You just cant publicly reverse your managements comments (no matter how ill advised) the proper way to do it would be for grayson to have made the statement. I think this may have been the final straw, though bates' refusal to sanction a new centre back (sounds like a freebie on £11k a week) would have seen matters at breaking point when hed just banked the Howson money. You have to think that the team on thursday was sadly the best we could do, so Grayson said - here it is - enjoy. We wont hear much from him now on this matter but nothing needs to be said, he's been scapegoated, but Ken - we can all see through it - now pack your bags and get out of leeds too.
2 years, 5 months ago on Who Replaces Scapegoated Simon Grayson?
i think bates is fed up, and knows he can only get best price if we get promoted, He'll want an impact manager then, as he thinks we can go up this season. I'm with you, we cant possibly go up. The squad needs reshaping totally and a lot of dross - the only standard of player we have been able to afford - needs to be moved on.
2 years, 5 months ago on Andy O'Brien and the Case of Inexplicable Nagging Guilt
Warnock seems a shoe-in but he wont get us promoted this season, it took him 2 to get QPR up, and by the looks of it Bates and Harvey want that promotion right now. With that in mind it needs to be a quick appointment too, with no compo or wrangling involved so that rules out McCarthy. I think it will be Alan Curbishley, hardly sets the pulse racing but surely preferable to Paul `nine defeats on the bounce at Notts Co' Ince. And a better track record in the English league than Gordon Strachan. I think Dave JOnes and Billy Davies come with baggage and Bates wont go for that. I actually thought to myself that Michael Brown wouldnt be a bad shout as a player coach, his legs may have gone but a good fottie brian and has worked under warnock, redknapp.
Grayson will be back in work within the next 3 months, and taking a team into the premiership. Bates' programme notes last night show just how out of touch he is `we're building a club, not a team...' well we're all right behind you ken (not) we already have a club, we need a team building...
the tenor of the official statement where they have decided to `dispense of the services of' simon grayson is totally unprofessional for gods sake give him some respect for what he did for us. Hating Bates more....
@number1inyorkshire@WoodyUK i hate bates and all his BS more than ever. With proper support grayson would have done a better job, and while he might not have cut it in the top flight, he can hardly be blamed for bates total lack of ambition. Selling Howson, Gradel, Johnson, Beckford... really what did he expect. He is an utter disgrace, poison to our city and team.
@TSS@TimPM I'd ensure your girlfriend doesnt read this..
as swansea and norwich have proven you actually need competent players, thats all, and a plan you stick to. last nights eresult was totally inexcusable. bates is the chief villain, but realistically we need to either get simon grayson some help tactically, or else we need a boat load of different players. With Bates back from South Africa (i imagine where he was on a lion shoot) he'll no doubt still have his rifle loaded for saturday afternoon. Anything less than a walloping victory for Leeds and its good bye simon. Who can we expect?.... Gus Poyet, Di Matteo, Dave Jones, Keith Hill from Barnsley... it spoke volumes to me when grayson said he `wasnt sure' if there was more money to spend, that suggests he is being kept in the dark by Bates. and shame on you Bates for selling him down the river.
2 years, 5 months ago on Supporting The Troops
straight into our overdraft caused by the east stand.
it also comes as part of the terrirtory that we in the stands or in our armchairs feel personal criticism towards players is acceptable. How often have any of you called down to Paul Connolly, Jonny Howson, Billy Paynter that they - `are sh1t' or that Simon Grayson is `incompetent' you wonder how they feel as individuals.
this is a thoughtful piece of writing Tim, and i had similar feelings when i heard of O'Briens condition. At the time he refused to play i found the whole thing petulant & not in possession of the facts i did indeed badmouth him tyo anyone who cared to listen. Buit in my defence the handling of matters by the club was dreadful, they hung him out to dry, which no matter how angry you are you dont do in management. They could easily have cooked up a story about a long term injury or family issues. I wonder how Grayson and bates feel now? O Brien said nothing, but those two...
Some people will point to negative comments as being knne jerk. But to escape this division you need to beat the big hitters, Southampton, West Ham, Birmingham. And so far weve managed a draw against West Ham, been beaten twice by birmingham, and humiliated on day one by southampton. I lay 95% of the blame at bates door. We should have invested, its as simple as that, and part of that investment should have been to terminate contracts - the likes of billy paynter though came here because they were cheap - i dont blame grayson for taking those gambles, because when you ahve no money you make do. Where Simon is at fault is in his tactics and team selection, theres no point trying to outplay birmingham, man for man we arent good enough as the scoreline proved. We needed to contain them once we got our goal, if everyone else can see it why couldnt he? to then blame a rookie defence, and go on to sign a 20 year old left back.... come on? will bromby, bruce and connolly save us?..... of course not.
@Chareose if you meet a stronger opponent the key is not to get beaten, weve had gutfuils of it when we went to the likes of hereford, exeter and so on - so why dont we ever learn? graysons calling the shots, but our squad was capable of a 0-0 tonight or even a 1-0 win. the team are NOT world beaters but they arent so bad as we should be getting beaten 4-1 1-0 maybe. They just seem clueless to me, and yet another underwhelming transfer window has passed, 3 loan signings 1 clapped out keeper for the season and one permanent signing of a player who is warming the bench? i've stuck by not going to Elland Road and intend to do so until Bates does the decent thing and sells the team to someone with ambition. We had an opportunity - could we really not have signed up Keith Andrews, Sammy Clingan, Danny Higginbotham with a £2m cash windfall for a fee and Howsons wages?..... couldnt we have afforded billy sharp for the same - hed have bagged us a couple last night. I can feel my liver fizzing with anger as i await the much used claptrap surrounding `thats what the emergency loan window is for' but right now weve more loans than your average Greek high street Bank.
so why didnt we make a single substitution, put white further forward, take off townsend, bring on pugh..... i know we all like to blame ken bates, but any monkey of a manager could have parked the team bus in front of goal, that performance wasnt good enough. I imagine Yeovil would have made a better job of defending against birmingham tonight than we have. pathetic.
no fear, we have a new commercial partner...... please god make this misery stop.
i think youre just after some jolly over to los angeles irving. Truth is hes a 14 year old in Stockton.
@number1inyorkshire@mattbb1@LAwhite i think they do review the web, of course they do you have to in business. and will bates slam as libellous comments made about him, yes of course he will, so thats why its important to deal in facts where we are able to.
@number1inyorkshire@LAwhite get the feeling Bates and hid cronies are trying counterinsurgency - to me thats brilliant - it means they re worried.
@Tyler75@Dje fully expect to see paynter, bruce, rachibka, all out the door today, in rachibkas case a cancelled contract. But i tend to agree, i dont expect to see much else happen, Wilson from Celtic looks like its going ahead, but its usually one out the door we didnt want to see go at Leeds nowadatys on transfer deadline day.
and i suppose its a sound business plan to under-invest in the core business, that being the football squad themselves? whereupon promotion would net you £25Mpa additional turnover, and the ability to properly leverage your assets, whilst investing in the infrastructure first - which isnt a best fit model for 2nd tier football, serves to actually damage your cash and turnover streams whilst people dont use them - furtherinhibiting your inability to invest in the core business? Just Wow! wake up mate, i had some great coffee on Abbot Kinney Bvd in Venice, last year to clear away the jetlag - suggest you have some - have a nice day. We all support the team, but the business model bates is using isnt just cracked its in meltdown.
@KevinScorah when you say financial demise are you referring to the period 2000-2004 or the period where ken bates took us into administration - sure i've seen you post before on this topic? my advice on both (if you are interested) would be to review the articles from the YEP, which are unbiaed, but moreover to obtain copies of the KPMG administration (which shuld be publicly available) which are legally binding explanations ast o the overspend at Leds United, largely down to an unpaid tax bill. That will be unbiased.
theres the rub... agree, the players anre not to blame for our predicament, nor is simon grayson entirely, and they should be supported but in doing so you line bates' pockets - and he relies on it. The answer ins to find a high net worth individual to repace bates as quickly as possible.
the total lack of activity both on the transfer front, and in terms of anti bates protest is disappointing beyond words. By the way we are sll d0oing our bit on here, every post, eveey article on here decrying the current regime - is visible on most search engines, so you could argue were doing our bit in terms of attracting an investor? but we do need to do more in this respect, the hard bit we all cant seem to reconcile, is yes Bates needs to go, but we need to get rid, and replace him with a new owner.
2 years, 5 months ago on Don't Fear The Reaper
when we played carlisle in the league one play off first leg, i met quite by chance Allan Clarke outside the ground - and i wonder what he would have to say on matters. I live in Birmingham now, have done for 12 years, and Clarke was as blunt a midlander as youd meet. He told me it was a `disgrace' we were in League One, I asked him did he think we;d win (we ended up losing) He said well we better, that DOn Revie would be turning in his grave. THats the type of honesty we need from ex-pros - shame on you lorimer.
I/m not sure that constitues evidence as such, but itdoes seem rather skewed, and to not show posts that have a `low rating' seems odd - everyones entitled to their views. Is Bates waging a cyber war on us? he'll just accuse us of paranoia, the answer to this of course is to visit the sites whose integrity you trust - and be vocal about what you believe in. I'm wondering whether we set up some kind of facebook stunt where all those anti bates hold up a #7yearsoflies placard on the 7th minute of the game?
@number1inyorkshire hey look i got my fair share of abuse for the `alleged' shaun harvey email...
saw that too... bye snoddy
@Dje@mattbb1 well that would be immoral...!
@Dje like your thinking DJE - though i take it youre not volunteering?
@TimPM give LUST a chance, Tim, though i agree when you get a chance - you take it - and it worries me a little that we might not. there should be a shout out to any investors in that statement or persons who believe they have the funds to support the club - though that might preclude getting any positive reposnse from the current board.
watching those bits of footage gave me goosebumps, a real legend - just gone - someone who cared as much as we did about getting the team promoted so Bates could in his words `trouser' the money. disgusting.
2 years, 5 months ago on Farewell Jonny - You'll Always Be Leeds!
@Dje i thought bates interview could be found at http://www.morebsfrompapasmurfthatitseveryoneelsesfault.com
@number1inyorkshire@TSS have to admit the prspect of not going to leeds again this season is miserable, but agree with what the LUST statement has said, each time i've been, gradually its like watching our identity as a club getting boil washed, and fading, fading, fading. The enjoyment for me is probably at an all time low. I still love the club and will always support them but Bates has removed hope from the equation. Hope that he'll ever leave, hope that we'll ever compete for the nest players (who arent on a free) for the jobs we so badly need doing - a commanding centre back, a ball winning midfielder, and a playmaker, a pacy centre forward. Sure weve got some, but when we need fiixes we all know itll be off to the loan market for some kid who doesnt give a frig about leeds united. I really hope that LUST have steps 2 and 3 in mind , the statement is a decent start - asking ken for more - but he will retort- "i'm doing all i can".
2 years, 5 months ago on Aston Villa A Warning Sign For Leeds
@TSS i've read that statement a few times, and to me the parts regarding the alienation of fans is probably sadder than even the chronic underinvestment. Smaller clubs on smaller budgets can make their fans feel part of it. If I am going to be critical however it would simply be that theres no `meat' in the statement - my gaffer would ask me - so waht do you want me to do? if i presented him with a list of issues. I think thats missing. I stand alongside those making thestatement but i am keen to see what the next stage is - and hopefully they have that in mind? if ont bates will cricify them, and probably in the media.
with the wages he's earnt - couldnt he buy the club from Bates..
2 years, 5 months ago on Desperate Times Call For Alan Smith Return
@henrymouni so we go and find one.
2 years, 6 months ago on Aston Villa A Warning Sign For Leeds
i have to admit that if I was in his position and really wanted to stick it to Ken Bates its exactly what I would do. Hell get his games from March onwards, and then a premier league move end of the season - the only loser is Ken Bates.
2 years, 6 months ago on Dissident Uprising Seeks Action Plan
to quote edmund burke - for evil to succeed all it takes is for good men to do nothing - quite apposite i thought as Bates is totally relaint on people shrugging their shoulders and saying - whats it go to do with me - but we the fans have the power to do something - we all have an opportunity here to get shut of Bates and get an investor in who we deserve.
@Gryff@TSS@paulclarkeonenil lets be brutally honest, i cant imagine joining Norwich is setting Howsons pulse racing, he will be in no hurry to do this, if i was a cynic.. I'd say he probably also wants to deliver that message to the fans. He hates Bates probably more than the rest of us now. He has every right to say - actually no - I'll stick around and see out my contract, I wonder if he will?
apologies, for carrying on but there needs to be almost an exec committee formed, including those with the requisite professional skills, Solicitor, Accountant, Banker and a package created whereby we :- A.) Prove there is a sufficient amount of turnover and cash in this business to make it worthwhile investing in b.) Prove Bates is making a royal hash of it, and is not a long term bet c.) Engages said potential investors, ensuring they are fit and proper. This way we effectively line em up for Bates, hes no fool he'll take the right price, but him being him, 99% of people have no doubt got bored and given up after 6 months of him.
i also think that if anyone in that group has the skills to engage investors - then they should step forward. I cant sadly go, with my 7 week old son, wailing almost as loudly as Ken when he gets a bill from the WYorks Constabulary for matchday policing. But definitely the right thing to do to get this moving. I note we are after Richie Wellens according to SSN to replace Howson... that on its own will turn the remaining 5% or so against the bates regime.
@Tim Campbell you can find leeches in most freshwater environments, especially where cattle are kept nearby.
2 years, 6 months ago on LUFC Chairman & Manager Confidence Polls
Bates is the ultimate short termist, he understands property but nothing else.
@TSS just shocking, but hats off to Ben Parker, who obviously has balls of solid rock, sadly he has knees made from plaster of paris. So Kens just pushed Howson through the door - he gets viler by the minute, and Grayson just stood there and let it happen? Hes going down in my estimation - surely he has to walk soon? We can only hope the players voice their concerns as a group - perhaps (and Im serious) their lack of desire on the pitch is a symptom of how they feel?
i dont give too much attentiuon to the bilge sites, but is it true that Ben Parker yesterday spoke out against the bates regime - in defence of Howson? - at an even in the pavilion next to an uncomfortable looking peter lorimer?...
but hes a dreadful businessman Simon. Not bg enough profits, nor any a promotion in sight? whats his plan? what differentiates us from any other club in the championship? Grayson does whatg he can with zero investment - £11.5m war chest?,,,,, thats a tiny wage bill relatively speaking. WHere are the investors? why spend on corporate boxes when the returns arent there and create a £7m debt - its his business accumen thats not working.
says it all really doesnt it. Grayson has been smeared (like all of us) by bates' regime. Disgusting. Time to sell up and retire ken - you have nothing to offer us, just an agenda of take take take. Money creamed off by the million, youre not welcome in Leeds.
i cant imagine a world though in which ken bates would tolerate an overspend... well not on football players. As i didnt go today i couldnt gauge what the atmosphere was like round the ground - are the fans finally ready to protest en masse? is there any truth in the snoddy rumours - ie an imminent transfer request?
2 years, 6 months ago on The £11.5m Leeds United War Chest
well put. Kens sensationalism may well be aimed to silence the masses, but dig not even slightly deeper, and there lies the truth. £9.5m would no doubt be his budget at start of FY, since then hes had £1.5M for schmeicel, £1.8M for Gradel, £2M for howon, and their wages off the bill so lets add conservatively £5.5m to that, and he is still underspending what ia available.
i think thats moot. notwithstanding, i happen to think what krasner and his colelagues did was very brave, and actually very effective. Leeds' debt was almost cut by 2/3 their goal was only ever to `hold the fort' and make the club as saleable as possible. He achieved in short a 33p in the £ return for creditors, without destroying our financial reputation. Bates reaped the benefit of that, and on similar revenues, put us in administration - and got us relegated?! so whos worse?
2 years, 6 months ago on Hacking Shaun Harvey's Inbox
i think you need to take an holistic approach in business. Was it unavoidable? no I dont think it was, the process itself showed there were plenty of other people who wanted to invest, but more to the point, only if the present regime had moved on. Can you condone it? I suppose you can, personally I felt it was a huge risk to take, and that it was sadly borne out of the fact that we had failed to invest in our core business - football - that season. Fine we might have run at a loss, but if we d held the 2005/6 team together and added a couple more - we would have had a shot at promotion - and debts wouldnt have been an issue, moreover bates would have sold up.
well i do happen to know a lot about adminstration, receivership, indeed all forms of corporate restructuring. Krasner was right, he knew, as a qualified insolvency practitioner that administration would risk an asset stripping of the club, given the size of the club too that the creditors would potentially ensure that administration may turn into a liquidation and winding up. Bates was lucky he got away with the administration, HMRC are not to be messed with, never mind them though, plenty of other creditors were left out of pocket. Administration is no guarantee of safety.
@number1inyorkshire@lou reed I'll blush soon
15 more years, 15 more years
Didnt you know hacking is the way forward..
nice one lou. I thought revolver was an excellent album. Hope youve kicked the heroin mate, perhaps not judging by the above.
i think Delph will probably fill the void left by Howson, so if it ends up a seasons loan then theres no need for Smith is there? I'm boycotting home games for the rest of this season at least, but were i to thrun my hopes to any of our squad, Roy of the Rovers style, it'd have to be to Tom Lees - cue Bolton Signing hom for £500K & a family pack of Pukka Pies.
2 years, 6 months ago on Desperate Times Call For Alan Smith Return
for shame TSS - youre an old sentimental at heart arent you! in movie analogies i see this as more like Lassie come home, as the `damaged' canine hobbles home from WW1 and savages some poor young child? that metaphorical child being the naive hopes of leeds fans that he will actually do a job for us... in fact it being smith no metaphor needed, he probably would savage some poor unsuspecting England U21 midfielder.
in many ways yes, he craves attention, so dont read his stupid programme notes. DOnt buy in to his warped vision of how our club should be run. We deserve a chairman who cares. If we had someone who was honest with us all, and even looked like he was tkaing football seriously it would matter little to us all if we were 11th - Bates is a disgrace.
2 years, 6 months ago on Don't Spend A Penny, That'll Show Kenny!
if youve bought a ticket already then go - but as i say dont spend a red cent there! its the only language Bates understands. Hell play every trick in the book to minf*ck us, blame us for the saleof McCormack - which hell do anyway. Claim we ended up putting the club in administration - if we start out again in league 2, then so be it - well get back but remember Ken bates has put us back 10 Years as a football team, the cure may be painful - but we need to take it.
It may sound like I'm contradicting myself here, but you should go mate, and have a bloody great day - Leeds United is about the fans, and the team - not Bates - thats why its so important to send him the message that he is not wanted by any of us - now not even the players in the team - Howson has done us all a massive favour in this. SIng Marching on together with your lads, sit on the wall outside the peacock eating some fish and chips from gravellys. The Shirts? well theyll be out of date in 3 months!..... youve bought the tickets so why not?
That's easy. He would fill the Chalice of Gondor, with Virgin Blood, on the solstice of the black goat, and in drinking that ungodly mixture make himself immortal - result another 250 seasons of his unholy tenure ahahahahahaha
youre right Paul, they wont humble us they will destroy us... lol
thats a combinatuion of wages and fee lets not forget. £10k a week for 3 years = £360K, so £600K for a transfer fee. If that doesnt buy us a reasonable replacement at championship level i'd be surprised, but of course we all know how much will go into the `war chest', a round number. I actually think Ken would include these konies in next financial year, and thats how he sells it to grayson. that said wheres the funds from delph and gradel.
2 years, 6 months ago on Leeds United: Norwich City's Feeder Club
@070707 Bates uses this tactic of `youre only hurting your club by these protests' he did the same when MPs started asking questions about his running of the club - better the devil you know, if you like. But that isnt right. Bates is like a cancer at our club and he needs removing, that may well involve some collateral damage to our finances and standing, but the fact that we have the resources and support that we do means that we will get back - have faith - leave this abusive relationship! boycott bates - dont go to the game. Howson wont be..
How long will Simon Grayson put up with this is the question?Like Howson he is a fan, professional he may be but by association his name is being dragged through the sh1t by Bates. I wouldnt be suprised to see him sour faced sat next to Bates at a Press Conference like El Tel next to ridsdale when Woody was sold. None of this is good enough. I read an article last night on antoher site which basically said that the players were effectively now telling Bates they werent happy with his running of the club, and Kilkenny, Johnson, Howson and O Brien are those very examples. Howson has kept his mouth shut since yesterday, but surely all he wanted to see was the board actually trying to get us promoted, when he saw it wasnt happening, that the promise of premier league was fading he's said enoughs enough. What price by the way for my shirt purchased in the summer - with Howson 14 on the back.... grrrr.
That aside I urge anyone reading this to boycott the next game, I'd planned to go but now I wont, I'll go to ttteeeesscooo.... instead. But come on do the rest of you just want to sit there and take seeing snodgrass mcccormack and clayton sold this week - because thats on the cards. Ken Bates has sent a come and get them message to all the other suitors, hes broke the bank with his stupid project and recouping funds - it looks to me like were in financial difficulty again. Kick him where it hurts,
i'm not going back to Elland Road until Bates gedts the hell outta there - end of discussion. I will continue to love my team and look for their result first, but i cant really expect much. When you lose the catalogue of talent that we have what do you expect other than to fail. Bates sold our best talent (Hulse, Kilgallon) the season after the play off debacle, and never replaced them. The same is happening now, he has run out of ideas, and thrown the money he made on selling gradel into those pointless exec boxes - roll up roll up come and watch 3rd division football played by 35 year old burn outs.
@lufcboy i believe theres a mathmatical equiation - Transfer Fee Received + Wages Saved = Available monies to manager. Minus Agents Fees, Minus additional charges for late payments on loan for east stand, Minus Loan from FSF to buy club = Zero. Amazing that equation always balances back to zero.
2 years, 6 months ago on The Fabian Delph Season Ticket Renewal Con?
@number1inyorkshire i disagree, we have a huge turnover of cash, the value of our brand, merhcandise and tv rights. i do partly agree with your comments though about bates, its pretty much paying a premium to get rid of him that an investor would ned to stomach. You would ironically pay over the odds for such a luxury. Quite what Ken will do with £50M at 135 years old i dont know? but he will expect it nonetheless.
a loan signing to replace our iconic, homegrown midfield dynamo - whilst id welcome back delph it shows har far we have fallen from grace under ken bates. We are an anaemic version of our former selves. The money we pump into that team is siphoned off by Bates and his Cronies, and the remaining crumbs are thrown into team management. Bates has no rspect for the fans or the team, he just looks at the turnover, invests it in his own private non football related interests and leaves us all mugs, i'm not only angry i am heartbroken to watch this. I'm praying someone is as angry as I am, but has a few million punds as well.
@number1inyorkshire@mattbb1 just so poor though isnt it, you try to hold on to your best players, and look how weve struggled without howson in the side, selling milner and lennon was understandable they were stellar talents and we were on the skids, but this time round allegedly we arent (well so ken says) Im now thinking Ken has blown the bank on his stupid corporate boxes and is paying it back with player fees, i cant express how angry this is making me. Its like watching a close relative or friend suffering. Bates is just a vile human being.
i take it all back... i really wish i wasnt reading this, so absolutely disgusted with what is happening at our club - worst of all? the absolute bullsh1t that will follow about a war chest - if i was grayson never mind being sacked - i would walk right now. Clayton likely to go as well this week I hear.
its now on the official site Howson has gone to the bumpkins - if you cant keep hold of a die hard fan, your most experienced defender wont play for the club then something is badly wrong - this is the last straw for me, i wont go to another game at ER until bates goes. Absolutely disgusted.
@TSS one thought did occur to me the other day that i thught worth sharing - why not create a `searchable' advert to investors for Leeds United? We arent subject to the Fuhrers media ban, and i think if the real truth of the matter and scale of investment is out there we might get the tractin we need - the investors would also generally have a mandate of backing from supporters - what do you think? I'm happy to contribute to that.
2 years, 6 months ago on Seven Years Of Lies: More Than Just A Hashtag
I was put in mind of ken bates the other day as i endured a 70 year old berating the kiosk attendant at the Shell Garage, the prices were outrageous, but worst of all, the price meter went up in units of 2p not 1p.... and so it went on. Ken you pay the going rate for things, or close to it, you dont pay 1983 prices for players, when is this sill old b*gger going to leave this club? I wouldnt be som dismissive of the rumoured £2m deal taking Howson to Norwich - though not until the end of the season as he is injured. The Clayton thing may have legs too I'm afraid. And by the way all this stuff were complaining about here - not the managers fault - its Ken Bates and Shaun Harvey. Whilst their pensions swell, our team suffers, shame on you - but we're all watching, and we wont forget.
So now Clayton thinks we're sh1te, totally unambitious and has turned his nose up at the £4.32per week on offer at leeds... so thats Howson, White, Clayton, Snodgrass, O'Brien all on the way, and Billy Paynter not moving, well anywhere..... surely we have some wages to offer when Kens ahem... paid all his professional fees to Ben Kates Solicitors, Kane Betes Accountants, and The Whitebeard Investment Trust. SIgn me up for the seven years of lies protest now, Ken youre a disgrace and youre destroying our club.
it all boils down to doing something different to set you apart from the pack, Leeds have one massive advantage - us - the certifiable fans. we love them. as long as we turn up then the current model isnt going to break. We need to clear the decks. out with Sam, Connolly, Brown, Becchio, Nunez, Kisnorbo and dont spend money - play kids, Gimpel, The Turners, Poleon. There'd still be plenty around them to make the machine work - youd have a very mediocre season like we are now indeed, but these players would get better. Increase in value, and be a cash cow for us, sell one a season - write off your commercial losses - some might call it genius... if you were a young player youd know youd get your shot at leeds, and wed then attract the best young players again, and rake it in. Are you reading Ken you unimaginative silly old sod? this is called strategy. If you wont do the dent thing and sell to someone who cares - why dont you try and do something that will make you vast amounts of money? we'd end up promoted - eventually, this way.
2 years, 6 months ago on Ten Men Crystal Palace Hold Whites To Draw
so now were 11th.... and heading for a season of mediocrity. Which we should expect with a mediocre squad, including only 2 prem quality players, Howson & Snodgrass. One of thems injured... i dont like the knee jerk stuff i read sometimes after a performance like this `sack the manager' is trotted out just way too often, hes not blameless, but he doesnt have the resources. He'd need to spend a good few months clearing the decks - at a loss, and then buying replacements, and i can think of a period in the football calendar that facilitates that. Personally I'd write this season off and start that process now, focus on cheaper younger players and start blooding them now. But our chairman isnt all about patience or strategy as i worte in my critique of his business accumen, he is a short termist and plays the blame game, only when we get a leader with vision, not necessarily money - because the leeds business generates that - will we succeed.
now officially bored of reading about thierry henry. so he scored against the worst back four in the championship, yes thats right french international legend thierry henry. who cares.
2 years, 6 months ago on Thoughts Ahead Of Arsenal FA Cup Clash
hi yes some confusion, thats what having a 5 week od will do to you!.... happy to discuss offline if you wish - youcan see my real name at the foot of the article so by all means message me on facebook.
@truefan as a democrat i respect all opinions, but you are coming across as a stooge my friend, if you arent actually a business associate of Ken then perhaps you are him... buckstone white is spot on, our brand is our most valuable asset, look at the wasge Man U generate (even when they fall out of the CL...) just for being Man U.
Lets get the message, well put, to the right people and get our club back - all those reading welcome to join in.
2 years, 6 months ago on Ken's Tight Ship - Sadly Sailing Towards Iceberg
@Buckstone Whites@mattbb1@TSS apols TSS though the domain etc was yours? dont tell me its owned by FSF!
@Buckstone Whites @TSS do you think this site is the right forum to gauge such support? i have to ask given it is yours!
not sure?... i would actually prefer us to be run by a businessman, like a business. Interested in its core areas of revenue generation, innovative, and leveraging its revenue and cashflow. In summary totally unlike now, where we seem to be run for the benefit of ken bates, for as long as he is interested. as ive said many times theonly stumbling block is ousting ken and buying his nest egg from him. that would take a very `un-business like' decision where youd pay pretty much twice over what the business was worth to buy it.
2 years, 6 months ago on The Mangle: Running the asylum
@Buckstone Whites you are right. i think there are 2 things that need to be done though - 1. mobilise opinion, to do this you uncover the truth of the matter and put it simply to a wide audience. To me the most striking fact is the total lack of investment manifested in no players of consequence getting signed. then 2. As per man united begin something approaching a dignified but visible protest - with them the green and yellow scarves, their original colours. WHen matters descend into mob type protests it plays right into bates hands. but he strikes thr gith chord when hje says investors are scared off by we protesting morons, we need to portray ourselves as not only right, but erudite, and organised, then the investors may even take the view that bates is someone that needs to go for the good of the team and its fans. so to go back to point one perhaps we set up a group on here of persons prepared to organise on the web / at the ground leaflet issue / documents detailing the chronic underinvestment & like wise on the web. then you get to step 2 - what do you think? who is up for it?
beckford was actually coming into his own at everton, he was sold as their finances hit the skids and £4m was too much cash to turn down. i think he might do us a job actually, and given the owners of leicester arent football people i think we might have a chance to get him back, on a loan till the end of the season, and personally i'd welcome it, he and becchio were a great pairing.
2 years, 6 months ago on The Return Of Jermaine Beckford?
@TSS i think this is the point i wasn making a couple of days ago, i think there is value in making a reasoned business statement based on the published accounts, once bates is shown up - in numbers - there really is nowhere to hide in the business community. I think such a report would actually make him sit up and take notice, There is (not wishing to sound patronising) a large group of fans who still see ken bates as the clubs `saviour' not only did he rig the administration process - which amazingly seems to have been forgotten or escaped the attention of most, but he is clearly making money out of leeds united (not a crime) but rather disingenuously claiming to be running things on a shoestring. O think we would be able to turn his silent majoritys views on its head if we did materially and simply explain things like - Yorkshire Radio are a major receipient of investment out of the clubs accounts, that Professional fees to the likes of Taylors law firm seem to receive over £1m a year in fees... gems like this.. that gates represent £16m out of £22M turnover, so why invest so heavily in anything other than football? i think we do need to do it and in simple terms.
spot on number1 i think we need more danny pughs, andy hughes (i know hes gone) and richard naylor (i know hes gone too) namely those who care than someone who might end up in a spat over wages like O'Brien or SMith -
2 years, 6 months ago on The Eerily Quiet Leeds United Rumour Mill
i'm sure he probably has some justification, but its moot, he doesnt want to play for us, so can we all stop tlaking about him?..... its getting alittle boring. and it wont happen. I'd rather we had a decent scouting network and had unearthed a decent midfielder or were raving about a good youth team player we were bringing through, not going on and on and on and on about alan smith.
have to agree there, i'd hardly call vayrynen a brilliant find at 30, where are the 21 year old senegalese and bosnian youth players we used to find when george graham was in charge?!
just read koumas is on trial with us and poised to sign? does the rumour have legs? this was naturally on a bilge site but also on wikipedia.
Colin, perhaps youre missing the point here... Ronaldo is a better player than Danny Pugh as well, he also wont take a paycut to join Leeds. Alan Smith is interested in, well Alan Smith, hes a Leeds fan thats for sure, but he sees his earning power and career as more important than that. I'm also going to suggest to you that Danny Pugh was good enough for Stoke to have in their Europa League Squad, and played a big part in getting them promoted from the CCC, its because he is a solid professional and a team player, not a big time charlie, hes a decent footballer at this level and a passable one in the PL, i think calling him a tool is rather `unfortunate' hes a decent guy who actually wants to play for us, so get behind the guy instead of shouting him down, hes more f**king use to us than Alan Smith. I'd have loved Smith to come back this Summer, but reality hurts doesnt it - he just doesnt give two short sh1ts about playing for his `beloved club'.
Smith had his chance in the summer and elected to earn a few more weeks of his recession busting salary (or should that be recession causing..) We want committed players at Leeds, not a mercenary like SMith, I've sat in the pro Smith camp for long enough, and seen him snub us too many times. He'll end up somewhere like QPR or Leicester, and good luck to him but I have lost interest in him, there are plenty of other younger, technically better players, a good number of whom want to come and play for us.
I've seen Sean St Ledger mentioned in various bilge sites as a possible centre half (hed be free) and mark marshall the `Barnet' (bjesus) winger. What made me nearly fall off my chair in bates latest Ken-alogue was his refeence to Gradel not being adequately replaced... yes thats right the guy you sold for £2m ken, and then gave your manager £4.89 to replace, sorry but what a tw@t.
@morleywhite lest we forget Enoch
2 years, 6 months ago on Leeds' Injury Crisis Continues
bob on Sean, the squad isnt good enough, and yes while Larry has to accept some responsibility for not moving along the likes of Bromby, Bruce and Parker at the back the limited funds he has available means hes often played a juggling act fixing one area at a time - if you will. Then things go wrong as they often do, players get long ternms injuries and you cant afford to then deplete your squad, personally i think this is why the likes of kisnorbo, bruce, bromby survived as long as they did. What I would like to see us do more of though is leverage the youth squad, why not use the turner twins (werent they around in the 80s?) thompson, hatfield, payne, a bit more often - how much could it hurt and what about poor old monty, our only signing for most of the summer, and we havent seen him once. Surely he deserves a place on the bench ahead of connolly! Bates is totally unreasonable to not invest and then demand promotion. And if you were SImon Grayson how confident would you be that the £2m you got for selling Howson for example would actually go back into the squad, you just know it wouldnt. Now I know were all morons but max gradel got us £2m of cash, and we saved the £10k a week or so of his wages - that was an immediate cash boost - where the f**k is his replacement and where did the money go? that pklus johnsons kilkennys wages, schmeicels wages £1m transfer fee.
2 years, 6 months ago on Squad Depth: Dissecting The Myth
sorry about the typing thats what 3 hours sleep will do to you..
This is porbably where my acumen ends, namely how do you deciphr the accounts that are published - in the public domain? what i can tell you is that a balance sheet can hide a multitude of sins, no salary drawn? what about dividends paid to investors, payments to professionals attached to the business and companies like yorkshire radio (affiliates) the key issue for me is to partner up with someone who can perform that analysis (as boring as it seems) because what needs to be done - and thi is ciritical, is we should all try to start thinking about where the money really is going?
Leeds might declare a small profit - but the debt column needs forensically stripping back and the issues on it itemised fully. We should be raking it in to put no finer point on it. Our rental payments on ER are comparable to a mortgage, so no moaning there, but of course our icomes from player sales and gate receipts, plus tv cash, sponsorship mean we should be investing more into the business than we do, and then into the right area, in my opinion we could afford the £7m of corporate boxes - they are as speculative an investment as a purchase of a player. guys, an open invite then - lets run through those accounts - compare the ratios say with Southampton? or even Crystal Palace.
what like bates is doing now..
cheers Chareose, i await bates nuisance phonecall.
thanks gents, i can bring £5 to the table btw if there is a bid upcoming.
baron greenback from dangermouse. evil - check, toady - check, henchman/harvey - check.
2 years, 6 months ago on The 1,000 Post Descent Into X Men Analogies...
the above is genius, i agree with it totally.
we did get him just before christmas and it already feels likfe a number of years! that said hes an expert dribbler, is vocal and feeds well. I thhink he may be the answer at our problem full back position? yes we are fed up as leeds fans but really what can ken expect if we dont invest in the squad. It was interesting to see thompson have a storming game likewise nunez. maybe they are due a run in the side and grayson needs to think about the so called first choices. Howson, Snodgrass, Lees aside I dont think anyone should be safe. If nothing else clearly some of these poayers need a break.
2 years, 6 months ago on Arsenal And Bolton Offer Contract To White
just finished a marathon burping and feeding, not me my new son if you were wondering and cant quite believe the 95th minute winner from mccormack, it is real isnt it? i suppose it proves we can live without keogh but still big doubts. Hopefully we're all just being too negative and this really is just a blip. Imagine the pressure on grayson, could you work for a boss and fanbase who simply give you no slack?
a draw isnt enough to save grayson really.
Well done Sheena Easton, inspired signing by Grayson, bobbed up in the 88th minute for an equalkiser, what? we need other teams players to score for us....? Forssell, McCormack, Becchio, Sam, Nunez 4 international strikers and we cant get a goal? what the sh`t is going on?
so 10 minutes for grayson to save his job. this is going to be interesting. Surely he is removed if we lose to 10 men at home. Albeit i can only see the website it looks like a dour game, but one in which we have no cutting edge.
although nothing surprises me, i can confirm that thompson dropped from midfield to right back, and bruce to the centre, so a 4-4-2
maybe thats what bates is waiting for, surely warnock hates us almost as much as we hate him?... plus he has nothing to do with chelsea so why would bates be interested! (joke) I'm sticking with Dave Jones as my preferred, but saying that I'd love to see us thump Burnley and go on a ten game winning streak! lets not forget we always get beaten by Barnsley. Even if we had a First XI including Vidic, Bale, Rooney, Da Silva I think Barnsley would still do us.
2 years, 6 months ago on Snoddy's Injured - Officially Time To Panic
i think O'brien playing is a moot point, but otherwise i think the above isnt a bad idea - do we put townsend straight in? no White? for me he has to play on the wing? i think weve lacked enthusiasm throughout the squad, and wonder if we need to inject some presence from the youth side, perhaps the Taylor loan was premature, I may be deluded but I'm hoping Grayson can really rev up the troops. Becchio notching right at the end shows to me there is life in that team yet - in certain areas.
the issue for me today was that on papr our line up was probably pretty good - Vayrynen, Brown, Pugh, Nunez is a midfield with 2 internationals, and 2 with prem experience, Keogh and McCormack should bewlaking it at this level, then lets go to the back 4, Connolly (erm argument falls apart a bit) but kisnorbo, O'Dea, White all excellent players, and Becchio, Sam, Bruce and Clayton on the bench?.... so how the f**k do you lose 4-1?! we should have decimated Barnsley.
the bilge sites are suggesting Di Matteo as the `ready made' replacement, i cant see him as better than grayson though.
please, no strachan.
I actually think George Graham would have been a great No 2 for Grayson, as organisation is the key thing we miss in my opinion, and thats what took up Swansea last year, just being able to string lots of passes together. Theres more to it of course and team morale is key, yes the players are to blame, but my head dropped when i saw clayton and becchio on the bench, they both need an arm round the shoulder not being consigned to the reserves as they are both superb players. Theres some hope if Becchio was still trying at 91 minutes.
@jimmyoneeye jimmy, in many ways youre probably right, but notss forest and reading had patchy form - not dreadful form for four games on the trot, and the manager `losing it' with his players. how can you make 4 changes, and then tell that lineup that some of them will never play for the team again?! I'm one of larrys biggest supporters, and god knows i've had some abuse for that, but even a blinkered fool like myself.. can see that bates is going to take action now. youre right, its probably not the best outcome and a sticking plaster appointment beckons.
i really cant see grayson surviving this, and that saddens me, i think with decent backing he could have got us promoted last year, and bateshas hung him out to sry with a total lack of funding for the squad. That said the type of capitulation we have witnessed today isnt acceptable by anyones standards. If and when he goes you watch him take someone like sheffield united to the premier league... who will we end up with? hopefully dave jones, but more likely strachan, phil brown or that p1llock Billy Davies. Really sad to see how things have gone. Can we sack Bates as well?
dear lord, 3-0 now to barnsely, i think those of us who were hoping for grayson to be around after the new year are going to be disappointed.
i note elliot kebbie has signed for Atletico Madrid, so there'll be another £500K of potential transfer fees we wont be spending on a max replacement.... we should have a running total of transfer fees received and wages saved TSS, vs wages spent and fees spent on this site like a Blue Peter Appeal scenario - Bates Out!
loving the detailed surgical discussion on an appendectomy! after 8 hours with a wailing newborn it made me chuckle! On which other football blog would you get that - i salute you. Snoddys absence will be a major blow, and hopefully no complications. Do we have a ready made replacement? no. Closest in my eyes is sadly Lloyd Sam who isnt quite good enough, or Nunez, who might be worth a punt but we also have the likes of mccormack to put out on the wing, we could change our shape and play Vayrenenen in a more forward role as an option. For me though this only serves to highlight the lack of investment in the squad in this instance the failure to replace max gradel. We have the likely appearance of andros townsend on loan I hear - but quite frankly we've had more loans than HMV these recent years, and it doesnt work certainly not now. We need players committed to the cause not someone p*ssed off to be in the stiffs (Bannan, Livermore)
Grayson may well have his faults but he has worked minor miracles with bates in charge of the purse strings. Never mind a three year contract extension, canonisation should be on offer. Lets wait and see how we fair in the january transfer market, a series of loans will be indicative of a disingenuous and unsupportive Ken. Bannan and Livermore on paper were what we needed last season, but neither wanted to play championship football, hence the half assed performances, and it highlights why we need to make some quality signings - permanent ones.
2 years, 6 months ago on Blame The Organ Grinder, Not The Resourceless Monkey
i typoed understand... sorry. now do you follow? look if i admit i'm being a bit of a git, perhaps you can too and we drop this now and have a decent online argument? ;-)
i felt your rationale that if we was likely to come to us then he couldnt be much good was pretty negative, and wasnt cognisant of the fact that we do occasionally sign good players on the cheap (gradel, snodgrass, somma)
i'm not a hardcore grayson supporter, but i do think one defeat in eight shouldnt warrant us all asking for his head. I find the up and down of debate on here entertaining, but recently its been a case of - big win at notts orest - virtually no comments, then one defeat to reading - 100 plus comments many asking for grayson to be sacked. i make no apologies for my typing by the way!
2 years, 7 months ago on MLS Winger Linked With Leeds United
beckford isnt a hit at leicester and they are clearly offering unsustainable wages. I think there is room for manouevre, but the key sticking point is probably that it may be preceived as a move backward for him, leicester may also see us as rivals for the play offs. If Bates could strike a deal where we pick up some of his wages, the transfer fee may become moot,
That said if leicester are offering him to Bristol City, maybe they are less concerned about a fee than we think. This is probably academic anyway isnt it? Beckfords moved on, and much like the smith saga he would only come back if we went up.
no i did understnad you i just thought your rationale was fatuous, as i've explained, do try to keep up dear boy.
a reality where when he is transfer listed and we dont have to pay all of his wages Matthew?.. do you actually understand how contracts work?
i read yesterday Beckford is being touted out by Leicester to Bristol City as part of a deal to get Maynard, we need to step in there.
you are fighting a battle arent you mate! there seem to be an abundance of naysayers, grayson out now followed by any signing grayson makes shouldnt be any good before they even arrive.. From what i've read about this guy he is very much in demand in Europe as most good USA players are, Landon Donovan, Clint Dempsey, are a couple we all know about but a good number play in Europe and do ok. and @Matthew you say one reason hes clearly not good enough, is that hes coming here? so how do you win that one? how could we possibly sign anyone good then, or should we sign players who are cr@p and just be done with that? this is where grayson usually shows his smarts, as he has with Somma for instance and gets a good player for nothing.
by the wayy TSS - is the offer of submitting an article still open to all? i may have a go!
2 years, 7 months ago on Poor Atmosphere, Poor Performance, Poor Leeds...
just read that we have signed Robbie Rodgers, apparently a tricky winger, from columbus crew, hopefully more Somma than Grella.. that says to me that Bates wont be sacking Grayson anytime soon, and quite right, for gods sake guys do get off grayson and the teams collective backs, you cant pay peanuts for a squad and then expect it to waltz all the way to the PL. If we finish 4th this season with the lack of investment we have had it will be a miracle.
for all of those dissing clingan, from lowly coventry, look at grant holt nearing 30 and only 2 years ago playing for shrewsbury, now scoring goals in the top flight, matt phillips now at wolves formerly of wycombe. Its all about how good the player is not the team they play for.
i can see brown being shown the door and clingan replacing him, clearly past his best. but come on a draw and a loss and the manager needs to be sacked... ridiculous. Has everyone forgotten that ken bates found 7m to buy corporate boxes? that £7m invested in the team and wages would have bought us the promotion we all want so badly, and got him £20m a season in tv rights alone.. grayson has got us from mid table league one to top 6 championship, to me that makes him a good manager, and one who a number of chairman would be prepared to back if he is ejected (which i dont think would happen until the end of the season)
mccormack £300k, clayton free, somma, free, lonergan £250K, kisnorbo, free, gradel £100k (sold for £2m) nunez, free.... imagine what he could do with a few quid, sure he signed bruce, but even fergie signed djemba djemba. do you expect a flawless track record... come on guys back the team and the manager, and start shouting at the board.
didnt grayson also sign mccormack? clayton? Somma? diss lonergan - really..., he also signed kisnorbo, gradel, nunez, Colin if you want another blackwell keep on booing grayson. as long as bates continues to not back his managers we wont move on. lambert wouldnt work for a despot like bates, delia & co leave the football management to the manager, unlike our white bearded property tycoon. If i was Howson i'd leave. our club is going nowhere, the management wont invest in it, and the fans are a nightmare. I wont forget that quote from the damned united, when the board meet Clough and he asks them what they expect of him, they answer "leeds fans dont like to lose, theyre not used to it"... we still arent.
@TSS dare i suggest we missed howson yesterday... is Grayson a `one trick pony?' i'm not so sure, though it certainly looks that way sometimes, I have more faith in him however than i did in mcallister when things were going wrong. I think we all need to be patient, Grayson will soon realise that he needs to have a tinker with the formation and involve NUnez and Varynen more. I cant believe Becchio being lambasted in certain quarters either, we are our own worst enemies when we start doing this to the manager and squad. The reall Villain is Bates who needed to invest in the squad in the summer and chosse to fritter it away on coroporate boxes - back the team guys. If anyone thinks there are easy games in this division then they are stupid, and perhaps forget we arent the best team in the division, we have lots of fans but we arent the best. That would be either Birmingham, Leicester, Hull or West Ham. What do you expect?
i expect more of this, i think we're on the way to promotion (yes i did say that) and players will be wanting more add-ons and clauses relating to this, whats more given their part in a potentially play offs campaign they will want to ensure they dont then lose our financially, when they might get offers from premier league bottom feeders or the latest South East Asian ten bob millionaire funded vanity project trying to get out of the championship.
Whites a key player in the side surely to god when o'briens off the wagebill we te him up on a good deal? but of course we know that wont happen, same with Howson, if we dont go up theyre on the way.
2 years, 7 months ago on Just Another Leeds United Contract Saga
Gary Speed is one of Leeds' greats. He represented as per what Strachan and Wilkinson said the triumph of hard work, professionalism and team play. To me Leeds need to rediscover this, and this is a timely message to anyone involved in the club, top to bottom. I'd urge for example the likes of Andy O'Brien to drop whatever issues he has and reaffirm his loyalty to our great club. 1992, and 1990 represent what leeds can achieve at their best, we need not to be nostalgic about this, but learn from it. Are our players the best in the championship? some are but not all, but if they all gave 100% like Gary Speed, Strachan, Batty, McAllister, Chapman, Dorigo, Fairclough, Wallace, Whyte and Kelly we will walk out of this decision, and walk out of it we must, not come 2nd or get in through the play offs. Go out there tonight lads and decimate Nottingham Forest for us all.
2 years, 7 months ago on The Football World Mourns For Gary Speed
@Dje@mattbb1 dont worry mate i didnt take it that way. youre right however it happens its horrendous for all concerned. if we do manage to escape this division this season we shoud dedicate it to speedo.
2 years, 7 months ago on Arrogant Ramblings Of Deluded Barnsley Manager
@Dje its on daily telegraph website, and they write it was a suicide, really sad to hear that. god bless Mr Speed. total legend.
just read on BBC Gary Speed has died? anyone know more - just gutted to hear that.